50. Pushing Limits with Jen Crane, DPT

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00:00
Jennifer Milner
Welcome back to Bendy Bodies with the Hyper Mobility MD, where we explore the intersection of health and hypermobility, focusing on dancers and other aesthetic athletes. This is co host Jennifer Millner, here with the founder of the Bendy Bodies podcast, dr. Linda Bluestein. 

00:15
Dr. Linda Bluestein
Our goal is to bring you up to date information to help you live your best life. Please remember to always consult with your own healthcare team before making any changes to your routine. 

00:24
Jennifer Milner
Our guest today is Dr. Jennifer Crane, physical therapist, specializing in circus arts, bendy Bodies team member and founder of My Flex by Cirque Physio Jen. Welcome back to bendy potties. 

00:49
Dr. Jennifer Crane
I'm so excited to be here. Thanks for having me. 

00:53
Jennifer Milner
Thanks for coming back. For people who don't know you, please just tell us a little bit about yourself. 

00:59
Dr. Jennifer Crane
Yeah, absolutely. So I'm a physical therapist and athletic trainer by profession, and I grew up dancing and doing all sorts of very, you know, kind of the standard childhood artistic athletic endeavors. So I did a bit of gymnastics, a bit of figure skating, but really focused in on ballet. So as I kind of grew up and went to college and grad school and became a physical therapist, I very quickly found my niche in circus arts. And that happened when I myself became a circus artist and really just saw what a need there was for qualified healthcare providers to work with these types of artistic athletes. And as I continued to work in that niche, I also discovered that so many of them were hyper mobile, whether they were regardless of where they were on the hyper mobility spectrum. That was a really big commonality that I saw. 

01:56
Dr. Jennifer Crane
And so then I started to focus in a little bit more on the hyper mobile artistic athlete, and that's kind of where I arrived today. 

02:04
Jennifer Milner
Nice. Well, you have been very open about not only being hyper mobile, but also having a diagnosis of Eds yourself. So what was that diagnosis journey like and how did it shape your choices as an artist? 

02:16
Dr. Jennifer Crane
Yeah, my diagnostic journey was very it was, I think, a little bit atypical or maybe not, but really the first time that I heard the words hyper mobile in the context of it being problematic versus something to be desired, like in ballet was in college when I was in studying athletic training, and then later in graduate school with physical therapy. And the first kind of memory I have of this is any time in physical therapy school that we would be learning how to test for ligamental stability with like, ankle sprains or vertebral mobility, kind of like the classic tests and measures that we learn as physical therapists to do. I would always be the example for this is what it feels like when somebody has a full rupture of the ankle ligaments of even like, ACL, all of the standard ligamentous testing. I was the guinea pig for my classmates to learn what it felt like to have a positive result for that. 

03:20
Dr. Jennifer Crane
And I kind of just, like, laughed about it at the time. And I didn't really start putting any of the pieces together until the end of my physical therapy program. So I kind of kept hearing all of these hypermobility things, but we didn't I honestly don't even think that we learned anything about Eds or any hypermobility disorders. It was just something that we learned as some people are looser and some people are not as loose, and this is can be problematic. And we learned about how to treat the individual joints that were hypermobile, but it was never really put together in one cohesive diagnosis. And like, this is the presentation of someone with Eds, and I think that's changing now in physical therapy schools, but this is almost a decade ago, and so we just didn't have that as part of our curriculum. So I was having kind of a very similar cluster of different symptoms that didn't really align. 

04:25
Dr. Jennifer Crane
I was having some dysonomia issues, I was having a lot of joint pain. I was a runner at the time, a distance runner, and I would get so many stress fractures. I had two stress fractures in my ankle and then one in my foot in a very short period of time. So I ended up at a primary care physician, and she basically went through my medical history, and she was like, have you heard of hypermobility disorders or dealers downloads? And I was like, I mean, hypermobility, yes, but I don't know what it means. I don't know what it means for this to be more of a cohesive diagnosis. And so she gave me a very brief rundown of what it was. And then this was a little bit tricky because I'm in the US. And at that time there were penalties for having preexisting conditions with insurance. 

05:19
Dr. Jennifer Crane
And so she kind of explained what it was, what it meant, and what treatment options there would be. And then she was like, do you want me to diagnose you with this? And I was like and then she explained what that would mean, and I was like, no, absolutely not. Like, I don't want that to be an issue or a barrier for me to have healthcare for the rest of my life. And so at that point, I was just like, okay, learned a little bit more. This is something that I went on and I learned a lot more about on my own, but it was also something that I didn't really fully understand what it meant, or at least put it all together for me as a person until much later. So I had that kind of initial what I call like, a soft diagnosis, and then really I didn't get my actual diagnosis until years later. 

06:13
Dr. Jennifer Crane
But yeah, I'm one of those people that I think a lot of hyper mobile humans can relate to where I'm really stubborn and being told that I have this basically fragility disorder, I was like, no, absolutely not. I don't want that. I don't identify with that. And there are a lot of issues with that whole train of thought that I dealt with later. But at the time I was just like, this is not something that I don't want that narrative for myself. And so that was when I really started to think about how I would need to train differently. I was running at the time and I was doing a little bit of dancing still, and I was like, okay. So thinking through what my issues were and how I could address them using what I knew as a physical therapist and athletic trainer. And then later. 

07:06
Dr. Jennifer Crane
As I started working with circus artists. That was when I feel like it got really interesting and really a fun puzzle to solve to help people understand the implications of this diagnosis and also how to take care of your body. But also do the things that you love to do in a way that's safe. That is a very long, limited answer. But it's not a linear process. 

07:37
Jennifer Milner
It's not a linear process. And I think that's something that we talk about a lot that seems to be I mean, as we say in so many of our podcasts, there is nothing that is like, oh, this is a typical journey to follow. But if there's something that's typical about it's that it is a multi step process that first you go, huh? And then you go, wait a minute. And then you go, no, right? And you have these issues that come up and then you sort of chase after them like whacka Mole. And then somebody says, hey, have you seen this umbrella type thing? And then you start to dive into it and you go deeper, and then you just keep going deeper for the rest of your life, right? So that is in some ways a very typical, nonlinear way to get there. So living with Eds is a balancing act in itself. 

08:27
Jennifer Milner
And we know that hypermobility disorders like Eds are extremely heterogeneous, right? It can be challenging to know when to hold back from physical activities that most people might love, but that people who have been diagnosed with connective tissue disorders need to be careful with because of higher risk of subluxations injuries, delayed healing, that sort of thing. But when you're working as a circus artist or other athletic artists, your job is literally to push yourself to your limits. So as a physical therapist, as an artist yourself, and as someone with a connective tissue disorder, how do you help artistic athletes sort of reconcile those two things? 

09:07
Dr. Jennifer Crane
Yeah, I think that's the constant struggle is understanding where a person is at and how to reconcile that with what their goals are or their career is. And I think regardless of what art form the person does, what activity they do. Almost everybody, when they first start seeking healthcare or work with me for the first time, everybody really needs to be told that your experience is valid, your symptoms are valid, the fact that your experience isn't like your peers is absolutely okay and you're not like people are just so gas lit by themselves, sometimes by coaches, by healthcare providers. So I think just teaching them to listen to themselves and listen to their body signals is the first thing to do. And the hardest part. I think. Across the board. The thing that I found most helpful for me personally and for my hyper mobile patients who are very active and want to be very active with all of that. 

10:13
Dr. Jennifer Crane
Whether it's a dis AutonoMIA symptom or joint pain or flare ups. Whatever issues they're having. The thing that is the most helpful is teaching them about heart rate variability and how to measure that and track that and use that just as something that you're always looking at and looking to almost get a preview as to where your body is that day and looking at the trends of where it's going and just a bit of a backstory for people who might not be familiar with that term. This is something that a lot of the wearable fitness devices and trackers use as a measure of autonomic function. So it basically tells you how recovered you are from the previous days stressors, whether that be a work stressor and emotional stressor. It tells you where your autonomic nervous system is. And it's something that if it's a bracelet app, a bracelet that's connected to an app that you wear, or ring that's connected to an app, or just an app that you use on your phone every morning, it's a really good indicator that helps reconcile what people feel like but maybe don't want to admit or fully accept with what their body is actually going through. 

11:27
Dr. Jennifer Crane
And it's an objective measurement. And I find that so many artistic athletes are so used to just leaning into this circus hurts, no pain, no gain mentality, that to give them this tool that helps them actually understand that what they're feeling is valid and can be measured, that helps people really at least start to embody. Okay, this is what my HRV is this morning. I'm only 20% recovered. I am like in the red, so to speak. So today I'm going to take it a little bit easier, train a little bit easier, and then on days that I'm more recovered and my nervous system is more on board, I have more spoons available. Those are the days that you can do more. And I think just being able to track that and watch that is a really great way to get on top of flare ups or getting into this chronic pain spiral that so many people get into. 

12:29
Dr. Jennifer Crane
So really, I think regardless of what the person does or what their goals are. Teaching them to understand the cues that their body is giving them and trust that and act on that is the best tool that you can give, hands down. 

12:43
Jennifer Milner
I love that. Teaching them to understand that the cues that their bodies are giving is the optimum way to train. I love that. That's fantastic. 

12:51
Dr. Linda Bluestein
Yeah, and that's good because like you said, Jen, you can use that regardless of whether you're a circus performer or somebody who's just trying to figure out how to get out of bed every day and take the dog for a walk or leave their house. Because we know that people it's such a massive spectrum and people are at such very different places from a musculoskeletal standpoint. We know that it must be really challenging for people who are in something like circus, like Jen said at the beginning, just pushing themselves in that end range and pushing their body so hard physically. How do you help them with the risk benefit analysis, especially given the lack of data on the long term effects of things like contortion and other exercises and activities that people do involving extreme ranges of motion, whether they have a connective tissue disorder or they're hypermobility for some other reason? 

13:50
Dr. Linda Bluestein
How do you kind of work with people to analyze those kinds of situations? 

13:56
Dr. Jennifer Crane
Yeah, I think that's a really tough balance because one hand, we have the fragility narrative that's so prevalent in healthcare, where health care providers will tell these people, you're fragile, you can't don't do anything, just do like gentle pilates and maybe some swimming. But if you do more than that, you'll break yourself. So we have that fragility narrative, and then on the other end of the spectrum, if the person is already doing a lot of circus or dance or whatever it is that they're doing, those people are like, okay, I'm just going to push myself as hard as I can. And there are issues with both ends of the spectrum. So I think that the approach that I tend to take is just to have very frank discussions and be like, okay, given what you do, a, I think it's great when people are as active as their bodies allow within the parameters of what their body can tolerate. 

14:54
Dr. Jennifer Crane
So I would always rather people be doing any sort of physical activity. And I think that with circus, and especially for me personally with Ariel as well, once I started to hypertrophy and gain muscle mass, my symptoms got so much better. So I think that if you're on the fragility narrative end of the spectrum and you're afraid to do things, you're dealing with some kinesiophobia, being afraid of moving, then the education in the direction of you can take charge of your musculoskeletal health and you can help yourself by slowly and progressively with coaching, working towards training more and hypertrophying more. So that you can help your connective tissue protect your joints. But then on the other end of the spectrum, we have the people that just go way too hard, way too often and that's not good either. So with them it's a discussion of, okay, like, what are your goals? 

15:49
Dr. Jennifer Crane
If your goal is longevity and you want to be performing for 15 more years, 20 more years, then we need to have a discussion of what is sustainable. What are you doing if you're performing? What are you doing in your act? Is that sustainable? Are you doing things that are well within your comfort zone? What are you doing on your off days? Are you taking rest days? I think that just the discussion of, okay, you need to start treating recovery and recovery days with the same ferocity that you treat training days and performing days. It's just as important, if not more important, if you don't recover enough, you're not going to perform at your best. So just having those discussions about these are things that you need to start thinking about if your goal is longevity and to perform more for longer. And a lot of times people know this and they know that what they're doing isn't sustainable. 

16:48
Dr. Jennifer Crane
But again, it's like they don't trust themselves and they don't want to give themselves permission to take rest days. And 95% of the time when we have this conversation and then the person starts incorporating rest days or like a rest week. Or just any sort of regular de loading phase into their training every time they come back and they say. I was so scared to take five days off in a row. But the first day back training I was able to do all of these things that I've been working on but haven't been able to accomplish. Or like. I just felt so much better and it didn't affect my training at all. And that's the type of thing that once they experience it, the buy in is there, they understand it. But then also having the discussions about sometimes you're going to feel not great. 

17:38
Dr. Jennifer Crane
And on those days you have to prioritize whatever it is that you can do within the parameters of your job to offload on that day. Sometimes there's not much they can do if they're in, you know, if they're touring with Cirque du Soleil, they have to perform. But there are often things that you can do within those parameters to still optimize recovery on days that you have to perform and train. So there are just so many different ways to start addressing that. But I think that, again, it's just about starting with what are your goals and what are you doing right now. 

18:18
Dr. Linda Bluestein
And that's really interesting when you're talking about rest, because we know that's when muscles do hypertrophy, right? You have to have that rest in there. But I think so often we think more is better and culturally we're kind of taught that. I remember before I started running into a lot of problems, like, I would train and dance seven days a week, and people tell me all you need to take a rest day. And I totally resisted that concept. But eventually, hopefully, you figure out that doesn't work. Like you said, the two extremes are equally problematic in different ways. I'm just curious, with your expertise as a physical therapist and with the performers that you work with, have you noticed any predictive variables in terms of ones that are able to have a successful career? And I'm thinking myself, what I have seen and my experience with this is nowhere near like yours, but exactly what you just said about the ability to develop that muscle hypertrophy, because it seems like some people, no matter what they do and I don't know if it's part of their physiology or their joint laxity is so extreme. 

19:22
Dr. Linda Bluestein
Their connective tissue is not only lax, but it's also stiff. But are there certain things that you have observed as a physical therapist that they're like yeah, when the person can do this, it seems like they're more likely to have a successful career. 

19:35
Dr. Jennifer Crane
Yeah, I think definitely having the ability to maintain muscle mass is huge. I think that there are so many different factors. I think about diet and their relationship with nutrition and food. I mean, I think that is one of the main predictive variables for success, even just, like, outside of the hypermobility world, but certainly within hypermobility as well. I think that most of the predictive variables are really just like the core foundations of how to optimize being a human. So I think sleep, nutrition, hydration, those are the things. If they prioritize that and have that as a foundation, then everything else is so much easier. But then the next thing that I think about is not necessarily a physical predictor or like a biomechanical predictor. It's more about their relationship and their trust in their body. So I think about the person who is comfortable talking to their coach and being like, listen, today, this is what I can do. 

20:38
Dr. Jennifer Crane
What do you want? How should we adapt within these parameters? Because I feel like this today, it's the person that really is secure and trusting himself and trusting their cues. That's the one that I see as having the best success for longevity. I'm thinking about, in particular, one performer that I worked with who she was working with a circus company, and she was basically there from creation of the show. So she was the one that helped to choreograph most of the act that would then be performed by other people years and decades down the line when they would have different rotating artists come in. But she got to choreograph what she wanted to do, and the coach suggested doing a neck hang as one of those skills, and she was like, no, I would rather do something else that's not sustainable for me. I don't think that would be good for my body. 

21:35
Dr. Jennifer Crane
And if I have to perform this ten shows a week, then I would prefer not to do that. And of course she said it very gracefully, but she basically was like, I don't think that would work for me. And the coach was like, great, what do you want to do? And obviously there's going to be so many different variables that happen with that. And you don't always have coaches that will be understanding in that capacity. But I think the main factor is just are you willing to stand up for yourself when you know that something isn't going to serve you long term well? 

22:07
Jennifer Milner
And that's a really important thing for people to understand. Not everybody gets to have input on the choreography. 

22:13
Dr. Jennifer Crane
Right? 

22:13
Jennifer Milner
And she was extraordinarily lucky to be able to have that conversation. But she was also enough of a professional and valued herself enough that she knew that she could say yes or no to this. And a lot of times we look at what can I do for the next hour? Or however long the rehearsal period is, or however long the next show is. I remember auditioning for a Broadway musical called Barnum, which is about the circus. And so they asked us, what tricks can you do? Everybody show us what you've got. And so they had all the dancers go across the floor and dancers were doing tumbling passes and doing all of these crazy, amazing things and the choreographer said, Great, thank you. Now everybody go back to the other side and please show me what tricks you can do. Eight shows a week? 

22:55
Dr. Jennifer Crane
Yes. 

22:58
Jennifer Milner
And everybody was like, because everybody wants the job but nobody stops. And I was really grateful to the choreographer for saying that and understanding that most of the people would not be able to sustain those fancy tricks that they did. So that's something important that we have to learn. Whatever art field we are in, what is it that we are doing that is truly sustainable, that we can do? And when we look at that, we also talk about circus arts, dance, skating, we talk and gymnastics, we talk about these things requiring a fair amount of sacrifice. So trying to find that balance of we understand there's some sort of sacrifice that people talk about having to make for it. Are there sacrifices that artists will have to make to be able to do this and range long term things or do you think no, they should be able to. 

23:51
Jennifer Milner
How do you feel about that? 

23:52
Dr. Jennifer Crane
Yeah, I think that of course there are going to be sacrifices along the way and I think that they're going to look very different depending on the person and what the person considers is a sacrifice. Maybe for some people, a traveling and touring career is just not sustainable. For them. And maybe they love traveling, but they know that they try it out and it just doesn't work for their body. And maybe that's what sacrifice looks like. Maybe it looks like if they're for recreational students, maybe sacrifice is on the day of your favorite class, you wake up and you just feel like garbage, and you're like, I really want to do this class. This is my favorite class. I look forward to this all week. But if I do this class, I know that the next five to seven to however many days after will be really rough. 

24:51
Dr. Jennifer Crane
And I would rather sacrifice this now than sacrifice the next eight days of my life to recover from this. I think that it really depends. And maybe I think for a lot of people, to sacrifice looks like not doing the cool trick or not working towards the skill that everyone wants or the skill that everyone thinks is the one thing that will get you hired. I think that definitely sacrifice is part of this, but it's going to look very different depending on what each person considers as a sacrifice. 

25:29
Jennifer Milner
And I think that's such an important point to make because we're so used to as athletic artists to sacrificing our body, right? Dancers are like, my toes are going to be ugly. It's just the way it's going to be, which that's a whole other conversation. Does that need to happen or not? And I know circus artists, you guys talk about losing a fair amount of feeling, like ankle hangs and that sort of thing. You're like, yeah, this is the way it's going to be. And so we're so quick to say, my knees are going to be shot when I'm older, but I'm a dancer, and so I'm going to go for it. My hips are going to be and we're so quick to sort of go that way, but we don't think about sacrificing on the other side, which is the emotional side of saying, I'm going to make the sacrifice of saying, no, I'm going to make the sacrifice of staying in bed today. 

26:13
Jennifer Milner
I'm going to make the sacrifice of choosing only to do non touring shows. And people have to look at that not as a sign of weakness, but as a sacrifice, like you said, in order to maintain a long term and healthy career. So I hope people are listening to that. Now, if people aren't quite to that place, because you work with dancers and circus artists and that sort of thing, as a physical therapist, do you ever need to have that hard conversation with artists about the professional choices that they're making, the things that they're pushing their bodies to do? 

26:49
Dr. Jennifer Crane
Yeah, absolutely. And that's for sure. The hardest part of this is when I see a person who's just really not listening to their body and making too many physical sacrifices, like you mentioned. As far as my hips are going to be shot by the time I'm 35 or my knees or there's no cartilage or whatever their physical sacrifices. When I see that, the conversation is always really hard because most of the time that person isn't ready to have that. It's not that they're not ready to have the conversation, but it's often the first conversation that they'll have with the healthcare provider where they're like, you should probably think really hard about what you want to do and is this achieving your long term goals? And I think the reason that they're such hard conversations is because usually it takes such a long time of hearing that from one person, maybe from another person, maybe seeing someone who's 1520 years down the line and what they look like and what their experience was. 

27:57
Dr. Jennifer Crane
It takes so many data points to really embody that. For a lot of artists, I never tell people, don't do this or you can't do this, but I always frame it as like, listen, you have a few different choices. Here. Door number one, you continue to sacrifice everything, and you know, in five years, you probably won't feel so great, and this is what that will likely look like for you given your current trajectory. That's door number one. Door number two is you start making compromises with your training, with your skills, with what you're doing, with how you're treating your body. And then this is what that looks like. And it's just like, these are your options. This is what I see as likely outcomes for you based on my clinical experience and my education. And then I kind of just let them percolate and let that simmer in their brains. 

29:00
Dr. Jennifer Crane
And then usually they'll come back and it'll be like an email or something like, hey, so remember when you said this? Can we talk a little bit more about what that looks like? But it's like there's no way that you can rush that process for people. They really have to go through it themselves. I just try to fully educate them on what the likely consequences of their choices will be. 

29:23
Jennifer Milner
And I've heard something similar from the dancers that I work with that when a physical therapist or medical professional says to them, you have to do this now, or it's a very instinctive shut the door reaction. No, I don't. Right? Like you said, you are going to be fragile. And you're like, no, I'm not. But when someone says, hey, just giving you the information, here's the two options, and just leave it there, the performer gets to go away and process it and chew on it on their own time and then come back. And I see them return again and again to that conversation because they feel led to. Let's dig into that a little bit more. Let's talk about that a little bit. What did you mean when you said this? Or what do you really think will. Happen this way, and they start to gather the information for themselves. 

30:14
Jennifer Milner
You really can't push an artist, and you don't want to push an artist to make that decision, right. You just want to give them that information. And I think a lot of artists have that fear of going to a medical professional in the first place because they don't want to be told, oh, you have this and you can't do this. And I always tell my dancers, listen, whatever exists in your body already exists. The doctor or therapist or whoever is just going to put a name to it and describe it for you. You can choose to ignore them like there's nothing, but you'll have more information. At least you'll be rejecting from a more educated point of view, right? So I hope people are hearing it's good to get that information, and it's great to work with someone like yourself that can say, here are those places, and here are the two options. 

31:03
Jennifer Milner
Do you ever see a pivot point where the risks outweigh the benefits and you want to encourage them that way? Or do you think that everybody's pivot point is going to be different? 

31:13
Dr. Jennifer Crane
Everyone's pivot point is so different. And usually I think if I had to generalize, usually what happens is we have the conversation, they change or they don't change, if they don't change their habits and their training patterns. Often the next time I see them is when they're injured, and then they can't perform, and then it's the same. It's a little bit there's more urgency behind it. I think injuries are often the pivot points of, oh, I'm not infallible. Like, I have to start taking care of my body and this is a consequence if I don't do that. Injuries are incredible teachers, definitely. So it's horrible. And nobody wants to be injured, but they can be incredibly enlightening. 

32:06
Dr. Linda Bluestein
And how important do you think it is for someone who is hypermobility to have a trainer or coach who really understands hypermobility? And how do you advise people to find one? 

32:19
Dr. Jennifer Crane
Yeah, I think that's something that if someone can work with a coach or a healthcare provider who understands hypermobility and understands their discipline, that's just like the magic ticket. I think, more than anything, it's just knowing that you have a coach or healthcare provider that actually gets you. And you don't have to do all of the backstory of explaining like, this is what this disorder is, this is what it looks like for me, these are the things that I need from you. I mean, certainly there are amazing coaches who don't have a lot of experience working with hypermobility that are willing to learn and do all of those things, but it's just such a big exhale when someone can work with a coach or a provider who really understands them. I think the best way it's hard because I think that these are still disorders that are relatively we don't really see a lot of coaches or healthcare providers who have this body of knowledge existing. 

33:25
Dr. Jennifer Crane
So it's really hard to find somebody. But I think asking around and asking communities and talking to other healthcare providers who may not be in your area. But. You know. Work with hypermobility humans. Just getting referrals and recommendations. I always if somebody really can't find anybody that works with hypermobility or doesn't know how to find that person. Then I usually will say. Okay. Try to find like a dance PT or a gymnastics PT or a PT that specializes in artistic athletes and they'll at least have a step up. I think in that understanding. 

34:01
Dr. Linda Bluestein
That definitely makes sense. And we know that the awareness of Eds, other connective tissue disorders, hypermobility, all of these things has changed so dramatically. In fact, I just came across a paper, just like yesterday or the day before that kind of a basic science paper about what they're seeing under the microscope and the different tissues. And it's just like, amazing how quickly all this information is changing. And have you seen an increase in the number of people that either have been diagnosed with the connective tissue disorder or that have hypermobility? They may or may not have been diagnosed? Are you seeing greater numbers in the people that you're working with? And with amongst those people, what are you seeing in terms of how successful they are with their their careers? So, like, in terms of trends, what have you been noticing? 

34:55
Dr. Jennifer Crane
Yeah, I think in the past few years, absolutely. So many more, I mean, just anecdotally I'm getting so many more emails and messages from people being like, hey, I just saw this post about hypermobility and I see that you work with people with hypermobility disorders. How do I go about getting diagnosed? How do I know if I should get diagnosed? And the awareness of these issues is really just becoming more and more common. So I think that with that making it a little bit more of not such an outlier term that people here I think that's a really great step in the direction of helping people who have all of these different, seemingly unrelated issues with their body and their physical health, that they're seeing this connection under the umbrella of hypermobility spectrum disorders. And I think that's something that's just been really cool, where people are like, oh, I thought this was just me. 

35:58
Dr. Jennifer Crane
I thought that I was the only one that had this. I thought everything was unrelated and I was just like this. And it's just really cool to see people understanding their bodies a little bit more and understanding how to take care of their bodies so that they can do whatever it is that they love for longer. 

36:16
Jennifer Milner
Well, we have talked about a lot of different aspects of working with artists to push themselves fully to the limits with their hyper mobility and the ways that you try to work with them. What can you tell our listeners about why they should recommend this particular podcast episode to others? 

36:32
Dr. Jennifer Crane
I think that based on everything that we've talked about today, this episode is probably best for artistic athletes who feel a lot of dissonance between what they do in their art form and their physicality and how their body feels in relation to that. And for anyone who really wants to understand how to bridge that gap, how to approach bridging that gap so that you can do what you love to do while also taking care of your physical health. 

37:07
Jennifer Milner
Well, thank you. That's what we are hoping to do. So we hope that it's a place where people can dip in and learn a little bit more. And as we said at the beginning, it's a very nonlinear process, trying to figure out your wonky body and how to handle your wonky body. So it's something that comes piecemeal to everybody and we're glad that we can be a part of it. So thank you for that and we're so glad that you are a team member and share your knowledge with us. Is there anything, speaking of sharing your knowledge that you wanted to cover today that we didn't discuss? 

37:38
Dr. Jennifer Crane
I think we had a pretty good variety of topics. I can't think of anything else that is immediately jumping to mind. 

37:48
Jennifer Milner
So if people have loved what you've had to say today and want to learn more or reach out to you, where can they get in touch with you? Where can they find you? 

37:56
Dr. Jennifer Crane
Definitely on instagram. That's probably a good launching point on Instagram. I'm at Circuit and my bio has links to everything else that would be relevant. My website is also Circphisio.com, so those are good places to start. 

38:12
Jennifer Milner
Awesome. Thank you. Well, you have been listening to Bendy bodies with the hypermobility MD. Today we have been speaking with Dr. Jennifer Crane, physical therapist, specializing in circus arts, Bendy Bodies team member and founder of My Flex by Cirque Video. Jen, thank you so much for sharing your expertise with us today. 

38:29
Dr. Jennifer Crane
Thanks for having me. 

38:30
Dr. Linda Bluestein
Thank you for joining us for this episode of Bendy Bodies with the Hypermobility MD, where we explore the intersection of health and hypermobility for dancers and other aesthetic athletes. If you found this information valuable, please share it with a colleague or friend and leave us a review on your favorite podcast player. Remember to subscribe so you won't miss future episodes. If you want to follow us on Instagram, it's at Bendy Bodies and our website is www. Info bendybodies.org. You want to follow Bendy Bodies founder and cohost Dr. Bluestein on Instagram, it's at hypermobility all one word. And her website is www.hypermobility.com. If you want to follow cohost Jennifer Millner on Instagram, it's at jennifer milner. And her website is www.jennifermilner.com. Thank you for helping us spread the word about hypermobility and associated conditions, we want to hear from you. Please email us at info. Bendybodies.org. 

39:37
Dr. Linda Bluestein
Org to share feedback. The thoughts and opinions expressed on this podcast are solely of the cohosts and their guests. They do not necessarily represent the views and opinions of any organization. The thoughts and opinions do not constitute medical advice and should not be used in any legal capacity whatsoever. This information is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. As this information is for educational purposes only and is not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment, please refer to your local qualified health practitioner for all medical concerns. We'll catch you next time on the Bendy Bodies podcast.